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All right, we're ready for departure here at the Pilot Project podcast, the best source for stories and advice from the pilots of the RCAF. I'm your host, Brian Morrison. With me today is a very special guest, my wife, Melissa. Melissa, welcome to the show.

Thanks for finally letting me into your secret layer.

Since it is Mental Health Awareness Month, I thought it would be a great opportunity to have Melissa on the show to help me share my journey with Mental Health and the RCAF. So we're going ask her a couple of questions, and then we're going to switch roles. So, Melissa, let's start with the most obvious question. What made you choose to marry a pilot?

Well, it wasn't the fact that pilots can fly planes or they can talk about planes or anything related planes. I didn't marry you or want to even date you because you were a pilot. So your good looks and charming personality were what won me over.

That's right. Yeah. Melissa did not care at all that I was a pilot, which is, I guess, as it turns out, for the best. What do you think has been the best part of being a significant other of an RCAF pilot?

For me and kind of for us as a family, the biggest thing that I've really enjoyed is just the community that surrounds this group of people. Everyone gets the training, they get the long hours, they get the being away and the deployment and the moving and all of those kinds of pieces. So everyone's just so quick to welcome you in and yeah. We have friends that I think we'll have forever that we've met throughout our journey in the RCAF.

Yeah. Ah, I mean, especially here in Portage. It's been pretty amazing. The group of people that we're with and the way we all help each other out. It's a real true community.

Yeah. And I mean, mess dinners are fun adventures. Once you have a good group of friends, um, and just the different opportunities and things you get exposed to as a family of a military member, um, you get to meet some really cool people. You get to go some cool places. I even got to fly an airplane at Family Day once. So that was pretty special and memorable for sure. To fly the Aurora.

Yeah, that was pretty all time to sit beside each other and fly an airplane. That was, uh, something as cool as the Aurora big four engine aircraft. That was really cool. Yeah.

My parents and my brother were in the back and everything.

Yeah, that was amazing. What would you say has been the hardest part of being a significant other of an RCAF pilot?

Um, starting from, like, the get go, we were how many weeks married when you, uh, put in on your request for a leave pass?

About a month and a half for the leave pass, probably about a month.

Yeah. We were like, all right, let's figure, uh, out our honeymoon and go on our honeymoon. And uh, Brian puts in his leave pass and they say, no, you can't go. And we're like, what? He just patrols places? Nothing's going to happen. Why can't we go? Turns out Op impact was coming down, uh, the Chute and he was going to be sent on Roto Zero. So that was definitely a really hard thing to deal with. Because even when you accept that, you're marrying a military member. Well, to me, I was marrying someone who would be on the west coast or the east coast. And we'd bounce back and forth and that would kind of be our journey in the military. Taking a plane that hunt submarines and uh, having it track people over the desert was just not something we expected. And because it was Roto Zero, there was so much unknown. They couldn't tell us where they were going to sleep, if we were going to be able to contact them. It kind of reminded me of probably what people felt like 60, 70 years ago when their significant other was going away because we just didn't have any answers at that point. So that was pretty scary to deal with, for sure. Um, I think for a lot of people, the hardest part is just a lot of the unknown. So we had a lot of unknown in the deployment side of things. But the unknown of your schedule, your life, like when someone's going to have to get up and go or when someone might be back because delays happen all the time. Where you might live for a lot of people is a hard one to swallow. You don't really get a say. We kind of lucked out a little bit, I would say, because we met after you were finished training. So I didn't have to bounce around the country.

Yeah, you already knew at least what aircraft I was flying and kind of what the future approximately would look like.

I mean, that's what we thought. Yeah, look how it ended up.

True, we did not see ourselves in the prairies, but that's been great for us too.

Yeah, for sure.

Okay, so we're going to go ahead now and switch roles. Melissa is going to take on the role of the interviewer and I will be the guest. And uh, by doing that, Melissa is going to help me talk about my journey in mental health in the RCAF.

All right, Brian, we're going to start with a question you ask everyone. Where did flying start for you?

Flying has been part of my life, or aviation has been a part of my life almost as long as I could remember. My dad is super into aviation. My cousin and, uh, best friend, Tim is super into aviation. We grew up going to air shows, especially the London International Air Show in London, Ontario. I just remember it was such an exciting thing to look forward to. I can still, to this day, clearly remember the drives there and um, seeing the displays and the jets roaring overhead that are so loud that you almost can't take it. It's just an incredible thing. You can't compare. There's no other experience like having a fighter jet do a low fast pass and the noise is just immense. It's incredible. And getting a chance to go on all those different aircraft and we'd get the autographs from the pilots and air crew. Seeing the snowbirds, there's no doubt that that was a big part of how I got into aviation. And then as time went on, I followed my cousin's footsteps into air cadets. And from there I got my glider pilot license and my private pilot license and I instructed for a summer on gliders. So it just sort of eventually became a natural path to keep following. But I can remember probably as young as grade seven or eight having it in my head that being an Air Force pilot would be a really cool thing to do one day.

So after all that, how did you end up joining the Air Force?

I joined the Air Force in first year of university. I was in the Commercial Aviation Management Program at the University of Western Ontario in London, Ontario. I was going through first year, and I had worked like three or four jobs the year previous to save up, but the money was gone and I knew that I had a choice to either join the Air Force or start working for a year, doing school for a year. And I didn't want school to take like seven or eight years. And also I had already kind of had it in my head like, maybe I'll join the Air Force one day. So necessity kind of met up with my dreams and I went in and applied. And for me it was a pretty smooth process. I joined under ROTP, the trade was open. I did well in the aptitude tests and the interviews and all those things and it was pretty smooth sailing to get in.

What was your training route like once you got in?

Mine was a little atypical, uh, because I skipped phase one because I already had, I've mentioned this a couple of times in the show, but I already had a commercial multi IFR license. And at the time I believed and had been told that phase one was a weeding out process, which we've established pretty strongly on the show is not true anymore, but it definitely used to be. And I thought, hey, if I can skip that hurdle, then so much the better and it'll get me on to Moose Jaw faster. So I went to Moose Jaw as my first flight training, which was a bit of a culture shock because I had skipped phase one. So I only had this civilian view of what flying was and moose Jaw had all these different terms and these things called overhead breaks and closed patterns and everyone else had done aerobatics and all those things. Um, so it was kind of intimidating at first, but at the same time I was ahead on just number of hours. So I had seen more different scenarios. I had more flying under my belt. I had an IFR rating, which no one else had, and that was a big help for sure. But I found that whatever advantages I had quite quickly disappeared as other people caught up. So I was really impressed with the military training system and how quickly it got people up to speed. Phase Two went great for me. It was definitely high stress. The most stress probably. Well, I can't say the most stress in my life, but the most stress up to that point in my life. But it was fun. The, uh, flying is fantastic. The Harvard Two is, like, super fun to fly. Probably the most fun aircraft I've ever flown. Finished that, went to Phase three, multi engine. And again, that went quite smooth. I was able to top both my courses, which, uh, was great. And because of that, I got my top choice, which I asked for the Aurora.

And why did you choose the Aurora?

I chose the Aurora for a couple of reasons. One was it had some variety in its tasks. So they have anti surface warfare, anti submarine warfare, uh, overland, which ended up obviously being a big part of my career unexpectedly, search and rescue. They do, uh, fisheries patrols, they do Arctic patrols. So there was so many different things. And then on top of that, they go away, but they're not usually gone more than a couple of weeks was what I was told, and largely turned out to be true. So I thought, hey, this is a good opportunity to get a bunch of different experiences in to see the world, but not be gone all the time. Because at the time I was single and I wanted to meet somebody, and obviously that worked out, but I didn't want to be always gone. So I was trying to balance a, uh, really satisfying work life with a home life that could still flourish.

And don't forget to tell all the listeners out there the real reason that you chose the Aurora as an aircraft.

Oh, yeah. Uh, I also had, uh, two big priorities for the plane I wanted to fly. I wanted it to have a cup holder and a bathroom. And the Aurora has that and a kitchen. So they call it the Flying winnebago. And that's partly because it's all wood paneling inside still. But it's also partly because it has a galley kitchen with a galley table. It has a little convection oven and a toaster and a fridge. And, uh, that's great when you're on long patrols. So, yeah, I definitely had its creature comforts.

So you chose the Aurora, moved to Greenwood, met me. Lucky for you.

Yeah. Everything was coming together.

You did a few tours, got lots of experience. And then what happened next?

Well, as we'll talk about my anxiety and my PTSD, which at the time were undiagnosed, and I didn't really understand what was happening, but they just got so bad that I felt that I needed a change, I needed to get away from. It wasn't the Aurora world, it was kind of a it's not you, it's me thing. Like, I just needed a change. And it seemed to us like the fit out here was going to be really good for family life and just to give me a chance to have some space to breathe and to do a really important job. So we asked to come out here to Portage, which was funny, because the summer before, melissa and I were driving out to my sister's wedding in Regina, and we had visited friends in Winnipeg, and we drove from there to Regina. So I said, hey, listen, we'll swing through Portage and I'll show you around quickly. So we're driving around and driving down the main street and I said, do you see this place? We will never live here. And a year later, a year later, we were living there. So, never say never. But, uh, yeah. So I asked to come out to Portage. My chain of command was, uh, awesome. It was a late request, but they made it happen. It kind of involved a little horse trade with someone else who was supposed to come out here and didn't want to at the time. It didn't fit with what was going on in his life. So, um, we've talked before about how the Air Force will try to make people happy. And that was a case where it all worked out. Um, our request was fulfilled. He got what he wanted and got to stay in Comox. And, uh, everything worked out really nicely. So I'm really thankful for that. And despite things not turning out how we thought they would, I think it's been a really good part of our life.

So right now you aren't flying.

Yeah. It's been about two and a half years since I last flew.

And you're possibly heading towards a medical release. Can you share with us why that is and what led to it?

Yeah, so I have an official diagnosis of generalized anxiety disorder and Ostsrd, which is other specified trauma and stressor related disorder. It's very similar to PTSD in a lot of ways. And because I'd rather not say this long acronym that no one has heard, I refer to it as PTSD. But if I get into detail like this, I clarify, uh, what it is and why I use the different terms. I just think it's easier to have a conversation about something that someone has heard of and they're very close to each other. What led to that was we have alluded to my tours in the Middle East, and basically when we went to the Middle East, I was excited to go, but I had a lot of mixed feelings. I definitely had a lot of fears. I met with a padre before I left because I was feeling so scared. And I remember asking him, am I a coward because I feel this way? And he said, I'd be kind of worried if you told me you weren't feeling at least a little bit afraid. But the big thing for me was we were going to fight against ISIS, and ISIS had been all over the news, beheading people, burning people alive, and I just couldn't stop worrying about that happening to me. And my crewmates would kind of say, oh, if anything happens, we all had a sidearm. We all had a nine millimeter Browning pistol. And everyone would kind of say, well, the last bullet is for me. And I just didn't know if I could do that. And so I had this struggle going on of, could I kill myself if I had to, and if not, what would the price of that be? What would I go through? And it was just this thing that I couldn't let go of. Part of how I eventually got over it, I think, between my two tours, was I bought that big fighting knife, and I kind of decided, maybe it's kind of silly, but I'll just keep fighting. Even if I run out of ammo, I'll just keep fighting. And I won't let them take me alive. I'll make them kill me. And then I thought, okay, that sort of solves my internal this thing that I can't stop ruminating on. In hindsight, that was the seeds of anxiety.

Yeah. I even saw it just in how you would prepare for your tours. Like, you pushed things to try to get better guns and ammo on the plane so that you guys would have an extra level of defense. You were like, I need a life straw. I need to bring a knife with me. I need to always make sure I'm hydrated to the maximum ability in case I have to go on the run. Like, different pieces like that. Uh, looking back now, I'm like, yeah, that's a little bit more irrational than rational thinking constantly. Right. Everyone's going to have those thoughts when they're going into the unknown, for sure.

Yeah, I think those were smart pieces of preparation, but the level of, like, it was almost an obsessive thought instead of smart prep. So basically what I learned from going to therapy was trauma comes in many forms, and it can happen partly from if you're in real fear of violence or death, that that can, over time, also cause trauma. And that was very hard for me to accept mhm, because I was like, well, if I was in Afghanistan and I got hit by an IED or ambushed or saw somebody die or something, then I would have earned this. But it was very difficult for me at first to accept, like, being scared, essentially for your life can cause trauma, but it does, and it did for me. I had to learn that everybody reacts differently to things.

Yeah, I know. A lot of the time, even when we would talk about it, it was a hard pill to swallow for you. And you don't think of PTSD being this thing that's long term, like, worry over time. You always just assume it's a big event or something big that happened if someone's diagnosed with it.

Yeah, it was very hard to accept. That's what eventually led to me being diagnosed and stopping flying. How we got to that point, we'll get to that.

Can you describe your path through the mental health system in the military?

Yeah, so my time on the Aurora was amazing, but it was also pretty high stress. The deployment started just a few months after I got qualified on the Aurora. So pretty much from day one, we were under that deployment schedule and that tempo and the increased pressure that came with it. And as people were deployed, we were getting less time at home to recover. It was a really hard time in the community. I think everybody who was there at that time probably would agree with that. It was still great. I still had incredible memories that we made during that time, but it was tough. So during that time, I started thinking after my tours, okay, uh, I'm a little worn down. I'm going to see a social worker. And I would see a social worker. It was usually in the spring. So I started thinking, okay, maybe this is seasonal affective disorder or something. And, uh, I'd see the social worker, we'd talk things through. They'd say something like, yeah, it sounds like you are dealing with a lot of stress at work. Which was helpful in its way, but partly I was like, okay, so there's not all I can do is keep pushing through and getting through this. And they gave me some breathing techniques and things like that, so they gave me some tools so I'd feel better for a while, and then I'd end up seeing a social worker again. It was really difficult. The last time that I started asking for help in Greenwood, before we were posted, like, I knew that something new and worse was wrong. Things just seemed a lot harder than they used to. And I remember that picking up the phone was, like, one of the hardest things I ever did. Uh, literally. I remember I picked it up and I hung it up, like, two or three times. I was in an empty crew room in the hangar at Four or five squadron in Greenwood. But I made that call, and I was really glad I did. I got connected with a great social worker there until we were posted. And at that time, I kind of thought, okay, we'll be posted. I'll have a clean slate. I'll be away from the stress of what has been wearing me down here, and that'll be that. Now, at that time, I really didn't realize that I had something deeper going on. So we came here to portage, and I started feeling a lot of the same things, just about I was feeling the same way, but about new problems. So I started realizing there's something deeper here. So I went to my doctor and I said, hey, I really need to talk to somebody. And it was really emotional. I had, uh, tears in my eyes, but he was very, uh, compassionate. It was a great experience for me. I got connected with a fantastic social worker, and she guided me through things for a while. And after a while of talking, she said, hey, I think there might be something here connected to your tours. Which was the first time anyone had said that. And I was pretty resistant because of what we've already talked about, that I thought, no, there's no way that my experiences have led to trauma. That just can't be. I'm just worried. I've just been worn down, things like that. But eventually she convinced me, like, hey, I think you should get assessed. And the thing I want to highlight here is that every step of this was my choice. So I think a lot of us are afraid in the aviation community, like, if you ask for help, you're going to be grounded right away. That's not the case. When I asked my doctor for help, they kept me flying, because it wasn't affecting my flying at that time. And he asked me, do you think that would be a therapeutic thing, or do you think that would be too much stress to keep flying? And I said, no, I love flying. Keep me flying, please. Um, and that was great. Then my social worker said, hey, listen, I think you should get a diagnosis, but you should no, a diagnosis may come with grounding, it may come with the need for medication or therapy. But I said, okay, well, what do you think I need to do to get healthy? And she said, I think you should get assessed. So I had a choice. Again, I could have walked away and gone back and tried to push through or use coping mechanisms or whatever. But at that point, for me, the most important thing was getting healthy again. So I went and got diagnosed. Then when I was assessed by a psychiatrist, she gave me the option. Do you want to do therapy? Do you want to do meds? Do you want to do both, or do you want to do nothing? So once again, I had choices for how this was going to affect me moving forward. Now I chose medication and therapy, and I'm super grateful that I did, because it's been life changing for me all the way through the TCAT, or temporary Medical category process. My doctors walked with me on that, uh, up until recently, where I was put on a permanent medical category. And every single time, the potential consequences of what was about to happen were explained to me, and I had options. So my big message there to any pilots or air crew or anyone in the military who's listening, is the system is better than you think. You should trust it, and sometimes it will come with consequences. But understand that consequences are different from discipline. Understand that sometimes seeking mental health may require a pause in your duties. And what that should mean to you, though, is if a professional is telling me I need to take a break, then I probably do need to take a break. Even though nobody wants to step back from what they're doing, sometimes that's what's necessary, but at the same time, it may not be necessary, and you'll have choice. So don't not get help just because you're afraid of what might happen. Don't not ask questions just because you're afraid of what might happen.

I think another important piece, if you do worry about the system and its ability to support you, is a step that you took many times along the way. Talk to other people who've gone through it and have that lived experience, because it can really help reassure you that you're doing the right thing or you know, what's going to happen next in real time.

Yeah, that's a huge point. I've had some mentors along the way, and they know who they are who have held my hand and walked me through some really difficult, uh, conversations and times where I was really scared of what comes next. And even if you do go in and trust the system, you're still going to have days where you feel super freaked out about what's going to happen next, or what are the consequences of this going to be. It's your livelihood, it's your passion. So I get that. And like Melissa said, it's so important to have those people that you can reach out to.

And I think for a lot of you as pilots in particular, when you decide to be a pilot, you decide you want to be a pilot for your whole life. And most people in the real world, as I like to refer to it, as, they don't have the same career their entire lives anymore. People get sick or burnt out of one thing. They might take a sabbatical or take a break and then go back or do something completely different. But a lot of you in the military, especially, like, you want to fly, and you'll go from aircraft to aircraft or posting to posting, and that, uh, takes a toll on your mental health.

Yeah, I think not only can it add to your stress, but it also makes it very difficult to ask for help, because you have this idea that this is a lifelong career, and you work long and hard for that, and all of a sudden, you have something that could put a wrench in your plans.

It's about the long term plan, and long term, you want to be healthy for yourself and your family, not just so that you can have the same career your whole life.

Yeah, exactly. We're talking about a scenario where, for me, I knew that I was measuring the value of my career versus everything else in my life, basically. And it wasn't a hard decision.

Then what was the biggest struggle you've had with PTSD, and what did you have to do to get over it?

We were kind of getting into that just now, which is like, being a pilot isn't just a job. It's a lifestyle. It's your identity. It's something that you just wrap yourself into. And, I mean, I would say to anyone who is a pilot, like, look around the room you're sitting in. There's probably mementos in that room. I'm looking around in our room that we're sitting in right now. And there's a model of every plane that I've flown. There's my old forage cap on the shelf. There's, um, Lithographs, which are like those side on photos of aircraft that I've flown. And it's a huge thing. It's a huge accomplishment. And you just make like, I'm a pilot. It's the first thing people ask you, what do you do? And it's an answer that every time you answer it, you can feel proud. You've worked really hard for that. And you're not just a pilot, you're an Air Force pilot. And, um, it's not to say that you have this huge ego about it, but at the same time, you feel pride in it. So it was really difficult for me to step back from that. First, to stop flying after I'd worked so hard to get to where I was, and I love flying. And then second, to realize that my identity was so wrapped up in this and that I needed to change that. So I had to think about how I got over it was or how I'm getting over it. I guess it takes time is I had to realize, what else am I besides a pilot? So well, I'm a husband, I'm a father. I like to work out, I love to go camping. There's, uh, many other things I can turn my hand to in this life. And I basically had to realize that and just have that shift in mindset away from being a pilot, being my whole life, to trying to pay attention and be a more well rounded person and focus on all the other things in my life that are important.

What were some of the warning signs that made you realize it was time to get help?

Yeah, there were a lot, um.

Yeah, a lot looking back.

Yeah, when you look back, there were so many. I got in trouble at work a couple of times at 405 squadron. Not big, but like, running my mouth when I shouldn't have. And I think in hindsight, some of that was you didn't know what else to do. I was venting. I think I was undiagnosed. I was like a wounded animal. I just didn't realize the place that I was in. I remember looking at they have this mental health continuum poster, and it's like green, yellow, amber, red, and there's symptoms in each column. And that's partly why I first called for help that time. Where it was so difficult was I realized, like, I was in the amber mhm gusting red for a lot of it. And I thought, man, this is getting bad. But, uh, I'll say when I asked for help this final time here in Portage, which kind of led to where I am now, the big things were I was having nightmares almost every single night. I was getting really short tempered with the kids. I had a real short fuse. I was getting short tempered with you. I would notice myself. Not only was I getting upset, but I used to explain it that if you had a gauge of like zero to 100, like zero to 30 worked fine, and then 30 jumped to 100, I just got overwhelmed and fight or flight kicked in. And it wasn't like I was wanting to be this upset or wanting to react this way. In fact, afterwards, I would feel so bad and ashamed, but I couldn't help it. And, uh, thank God it never went somewhere really bad, but it wasn't pleasant for anybody. And I would smack my hand on a table and yell or whatever. It wasn't the person that I wanted to be. So there was that. In terms of my personal life at work, I mostly noticed that I was getting really overwhelmed with stuff that used to be fine. I loved doing pilot stuff. One of my best things that would happen at 405 sometimes is they'd say, hey, we need someone to go to Scotland tomorrow, and you got to run around and do all this crazy stuff and plan out this adventure. And I loved it.

You'd call me and be like, babe, I'm going to Scotland.

And yeah, it was great. It was exciting. And then I was here planning out compared to the aurora, uh, very simple trips. I was back to where I learned to fly, where I did very well on that course. And on an airplane I knew I was flying with. All my instructors were also my friends. It should have been the lowest stress. Like, yeah, I was learning new skills, and there's a learning curve, and that can be a little uncomfortable sometimes. But it was all stuff that I enjoyed, and it was with people I really enjoyed flying with but I was still getting really stressed out before flights. I was losing sleep. Um, I was having kind of panic attacks at night where I couldn't sleep, and that would kind of send me into an anxiety attack. If the weather changed and I had to replan a flight, I would find that very stressful, which is just your basics of flying. That's got to be something that you can just do. So I think there was a lot of signs, and eventually they all just piled up. The biggest thing, uh, by the end, was I kind of had this thing in my head, this thought that kept coming back, that was, I'm not okay, I'm not okay, I'm not okay. And I realized, I got to get some help here. Yeah.

And I think that was part of just your generalized anxiety spin that really picked up once we moved here, where it could be the tiniest thing, like going to the grocery store, and it just would spiral you and result in 1000 phone calls and text messages to me trying to get a few groceries, right?

Uh, yeah, that's right. If Melissa sent me to the grocery store with a list, like there was something on there I had a question about, I would call her, like, ten times and get so overwhelmed if I couldn't get hold of her. And I started feeling very overwhelmed in grocery stores and going to Walmart and all those things. What else did you see? Because usually one thing that therapists and stuff will tell you is your spouse can be, like, the best barometer for how you're doing.

Yeah, for me, it was, like, the stress, not sleeping before simple test flights that you knew you had in the bag, so to speak. Uh, the short fuse and the anger were definitely like, whoa. This was not something that was here before and is now a very predominant part of our life. And at that time, our child was not two yet, so was just starting to pick up on those kinds of things. So we wanted to really put a stop to those for the better for our family. Um, and, yeah, just the anxiety spin of simple tasks were very hard for you to do, and that made it very hard on me because I had to kind of hold those things together at home.

Yeah, that's one of the difficult things for everybody of these things in a relationship, is if I can't do something, you're picking that up. And then there is that compounded sense of guilt or sense of, I'm failing, I'm failing my family, and they have to pick up the slack. It's been another thing that takes time to deal with. And that's one of those things that you just have to maintain an open dialogue about, especially you have to tell me if it's getting overwhelming. And I got to tell you, like, hey, this is making me feel this way.

Marriage counseling. It's a good thing.

Yeah, that's true. That's something that we did. Not because we felt like we were falling apart, but we felt like we needed some extra tools to be able to talk through anxiety, talk through trauma, and just better communication, because we were finding ourselves in these patterns of arguments and things that we just weren't equipped to deal with anymore. Based on everything that I was dealing with.

For you, your mental health journey has meant you had to sacrifice flying. Is that forever or just a temporary thing?

Well, I think it's at this point a permanent thing within the military because, like I said, we did put in my permanent medical category, and I suspect that that will lead to a medical release. Um, that's not for sure, but it's very unlikely that I would fly again in the military. Outside of the military, we'll have to see. I certainly intend one day to fly at least in a private capacity in smaller aircraft. Anything else beyond that, we'll just have to see, uh, what time holds.

How have you dealt with not being able to fly?

Well, not being able to fly has been pretty difficult, especially living near the school and seeing the aircraft flying overhead every day. Certainly I would say that doing this podcast has been therapeutic. It's given me the opportunity to still talk shop, to sit down and be a pilot and talk with my pilot buddies and talk about all the stuff that I love about flying. And it's kind of giving me that opportunity to still explore that universe while healing. I think the other thing is what we've already talked about with being a pilot, being your identity and having to move beyond that. And the biggest thing has been for me to just get out there and coach soccer for our son or just do things outside of that sphere of what I was normally used to walking in, I think.

Is there anything positive that has come out of this process so far?

Yeah, I think there's been payoffs for the sacrifice, obviously the first one being my own improved mental health. I still have a long way to go. I think one thing I had to realize early on is that this is a long path to walk. And I think both of us were hoping this would be a quick fix and life would go back to how it used to be and I'd be flying and everything would be fine and that would be that we'd all learn a lesson and live happily ever after. And, um, I think we both found that it's been different from that.

Oh, yeah. I definitely thought it was going to be like a year of not flying therapy, finding the right balance of medication, and then you'd slowly work your way back into doing the job and training people again. And instead it felt a lot like anyone who has kids out there will understand the path toddlers take to learning to manage and deal with their emotions. You and Hendrik were kind of learning on the same on the same curve and level for a while, which was cool to see over time, but also hard to watch.

Yeah. And it takes time. Right. It comes with its own setbacks. It's not a linear progress all the time.

That was a hard one for me.

Yeah, because you thought progress would be linear and it would just always improve and you'd never have setbacks.

It was a very big roller coaster ride.

Yeah. And that's just the way it is. And I should say that there are people, though, who go through this process, get help and they do improve quickly and they go back to work. There is no typical case. Everybody's different, everybody has different experiences and everybody heals differently. So I think that's important to emphasize other things that I've gained. Obviously, I think our relationship is so much stronger than it was, uh, when this all started. I'm a much better and more patient father. I think I'm a better friend because I'm out of my head more and more able to pay attention to other people. That's definitely a problem with anxiety. When you're stuck inside your own head so much, it's really hard to be present. I would say. The other huge thing that has come from getting better and getting help and doing this show and also just being so open about these mental health struggles is when people reach out to me. I've had several people who I don't know, who have seen me write about this online, uh, or through the podcast or make mention of it and they reach out and they say, hey, I'm seeing myself in what you're saying, I'm recognizing myself in these symptoms, what can I do? And then I've been able to help those people to connect with the services they need or to talk it through or whatever. And obviously I'm not a professional, but I have my own experiences and it gives me a chance to be sort of a mentor in the same capacity that so many people were to me when I needed help. And it's very rewarding and it's definitely given me a passion for mental health advocacy.

Do you think your friends and family acted differently around you after you were grounded? Were they supportive of you choosing this path?

How did you feel?

It was hard for me because I just didn't fully understand exactly what was going on. Right. Like, I saw the signs and symptoms side of it, but didn't necessarily know what was going on in your head all the time until much further along the journey because I think you were trying to kind of hold a lot of it in and keep pushing through for a long time. We didn't talk about it until much later, which, looking back, I'm like, oh, if I knew you were feeling that way, I probably would have gone into the whole process a little bit more supportive than I probably was, because I just thought it was, just go deal with it, get better.

You just thought it was a little thing. I think I did too. Um, now, that being said, I would say that all of my friends and family have been incredibly supportive. Um, nobody has ever looked at me differently. Nobody has treated me, as far as I know, anyways, with kid gloves. Um, I've had friends who have been willing to share hard truths, and I've had friends who have been incredibly supportive throughout the process. Yeah, I think I've just received nothing but support. Certainly there's been nothing like not being, quote unquote, one of the guys anymore or something like that. Uh, just because I'm not flying, or just because I admitted I had an issue. I've had no negative treatment, no repercussions leadership, peers. Everybody has been incredibly supportive. So for me, it's been very positive.

In the military, there's always been a stigma surrounding mental health, and I know pilots are often afraid to ask for help. Do you think that's still an issue today?

So when it comes to stigma, I think that there's two pieces to it. I think there's an external stigma and an internal stigma. So one that is kind of put on you by society and one that's put on you by yourself. I think the societal stigma is a lot less than it used to be in the Air Force. I don't really feel like I experienced any kind of stigma. Like, for the most part, everybody was very supportive and just wanted me to get better, get the help that I needed. That includes my peers, my leadership. Everybody was super, super supportive and just want people to be healthy. And I would say the same of myself if I had a peer that was struggling. The first thing you're going to say to them, hopefully, is, hey, listen, you need to talk to somebody, and here's where those resources are. And I think that's easy to do. I think the harder stigma to break through is your own self imposed stigma about, like I said before, have I earned this? Is it really that bad? There's lots of people who have it worse, and I have a job to do, and I think that's the harder stigma to jump through. Does that make sense?

Yeah. You've definitely been more at peace, though, since you, uh, got over that part.

It's something that you have to get over if you're going to get better. And you just have to sort of grow up and say, I'm going to take care of this, I'm going to take this head on, and I'm not going to be embarrassed about it. And that's partly why I'm talking about it today. That's partly why I've, uh, always been pretty open about it since I was diagnosed.

You got to do what's best for you and your family at the end of the day.

Yeah, exactly.

What would you tell someone who's listening right now if these conversations are kind of resonating with them?

I mean, the big thing is get help. If this is resonating with you, if you are recognizing yourself in what we've talked about today, go talk to somebody. It's the kindest thing you can ever do for yourself. And I promise it is not as scary as you think it is going to be. The hardest part is making the call, and that's a cliche for a reason. The hardest part is picking up the phone. But what that means is the rest is easier. You go in and you get this weight that comes off your shoulders and it is just so worth it to go and get this figured out because you don't have to live this way. That's something I pushed through for years, not realizing it. And then something clicked and I realized like, I needed help. And if this is that click for you, then please get help because you don't need to live feeling the way you've been feeling.

And yeah, if you're a military spouse or partner, definitely you'll hear about this mental health continuum a lot, especially as the military kind of swings their focus to how they support families to be more about mental health. Like, recognize the signs yourself. If you're seeing things that are going on that you're like, you weren't like this six months ago, or you're getting really negative or short tempered or short fused, push your military member to go talk to someone and get help because it's not normal to feel that way. And there could be something going on or it could just be something they need some coping tools for. Definitely get that support. And if you yourself are starting to kind of see patterns or symptoms that are kind of making you swing more towards the red than staying in that green and yellow category yourself, then get help for yourself because it is a lot to take on as a family member of someone in the military. There's a lot going on, a lot to deal with. And you matter too.

Mhm absolutely. The other thing I would say is that there's a thousand excuses for why you think you can't go. Whether it's because you think that that would screw people over at work or you think that the job just won't go on without you or whatever, I promise you, you are replaceable. And your coworkers and your leaders have a responsibility to facilitate you getting help. Full stop. There's no excuse. There's nothing more important. You can't run from it forever. You can push through it for a long time, but eventually it's going to catch up to you. So if you're hearing this and I'm talking to you and you know I'm talking to you go get help.

Where can someone in the military get help if they need it?

So you've got a few different options. First of all, if you see anyone at work that has a sentinel patch on their uniform, that means they're trained in the Sentinel Program and they can actually help direct you to the proper services. They're trained to respect your confidentiality and they're trained in what services you may need, depending on what's going on. The other big program you can use is called the CF Member Assistance Program, or SIF. Map. Take out your phone and put this number in your phone. I have had this number in my phone. I can't recall if it was basic training or Moose job, but either way, this number has been in my phone for over ten years. I have used it a couple of times and I'll explain it after I give the number. The number is 1802 687708. And what Siftmap does is they connect you with a free number of sessions with a therapist from an approved list in your area. It's completely independent from your chain of command. Nobody in the military finds out and it's amazing. They will hook you up and it's confidential. And that can at least get you started on that road and sort of let you dip your toes into getting some help and seeing what that's like. Finally, you can just talk to your doctor and on many basis you can self assess into mental health and just go in and ask for an appointment. That's typically what I've done. I've had great success with that. Doctors are people, they're compassionate and they're going to help you get connected with the right services. And, uh, I've had very, very great experiences working with the mental health services in the military. So please contact your mental health unit on your base if, uh, that's an option for you and they'll take care.

Of you and yeah, it doesn't have to just be for a big thing. You don't have to suspect that you have an operational stress injury or PTSD to access those things. Anytime you're feeling overwhelmed or a little bit burnt out, like, just get used to having that as a tool in your toolbox that you access regularly. And then if big things do come up throughout your military career, it makes it not so scary to reach out and ask for help.

Yeah, absolutely. And, um, the other thing I'll say is you can always shoot me a message on social media. We put our contact information at the end of every episode. I have had people contact me through the show for lots of different reasons. I welcome anybody reaching out to chat or talk about the show or whatever, but I'm certainly always, uh, open to talking to anyone about stuff they're going through and helping them to figure out, um, what to do next to help deal with that. So that's always an option, too.

All right, well, that wraps it up for us here today on the Pilot Project podcast. We got a baby crying upstairs, but I want to thank you, Brian, for sharing your story with everybody today and being so open about it.

Yeah, thanks, hon. And thank you so much for coming in here today and helping to make this discussion happen and for sharing your insight as a spouse. Uh, it's definitely not an easy road to walk and I'm very thankful that you've walked beside me on it. So thank you, love. Uh, yeah, love you, too.

Okay, that's going to wrap things up for this episode. We want to thank you so much for joining us as we discuss my journey through mental health and the mental health system in the RCAF. For our next episode, we'll be staying on theme with mental health awareness and talking about a fairly heavy topic. Imagine you're out on a training mission and you get a call. A pilot has crashed in another aircraft and you need to respond to the scene. Now imagine that late in the day you find out that the person you've been helping recover was one of your best friends for Vic. Unfortunately, this scenario was reality. Listeners will remember Vic from our phase two helicopter episode. If you haven't listened to it, I highly recommend you go back and check it out.

Vic will tell us all about his.

Time flying combat support as well as his experiences on the tragic day when Tom Toast McQueen died in a crash. Do you have any questions or comments about anything you've heard or suggestions for the show? You can reach us at thepilotprojectpodcast at uh@gmail.com or at podpilotproject on all social media. We absolutely love hearing from our listeners. As always, we want to thank you for your continued support. As we keep experiencing amazing growth in listenership, we want to keep asking for your help with the big three that's like and follow us on social media. Share with your friends and follow and rate us five stars wherever you get your podcasts. Seriously, tell five friends about the show.

That's all for now.

Thanks for listening. Keep the blue side up.

See you.