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Bryan: 00:58

Alright. We're ready for departure here at the pilot project podcast, the best source for stories and advice from RCAF and mission aviation pilots brought to you by Sky's Magazine. I'm your host, Brian Morrison. With me today is Eli, a captain and pilot in the RCAF and recent graduate of lead in fighter training or LIFT in Italy. Eli, you might be my first listener to become a guest, so welcome to the show.

Eli: 01:19

Hi, Brian. Really happy to be here.

Bryan: 01:22

So today, we'll be talking about Eli's career so far in the RCAF and his experiences flying the lead in fighter training course in Italy. But before we jump into any of that, let's go through Eli's bio. Eli was born in Prince George BC, but spent his formative years in Kelowna. He grew up loving to travel and was fascinated by airplanes, so he thought being a pilot would be a neat way to see the world. The interior of BC has very little military presence, it wasn't until a trip to Europe to visit the Canadian battlefields of World War one and World War two that he developed a strong desire to serve and so becoming a pilot via the military became his new goal.

Bryan: 01:55

Eli joined the RCAF in 2015 under the regular training plan and studied physics and space science at RMC. Following his second year, he had the opportunity to travel to Ireland for the summer to OJT at the International Space University's space studies program. After third year, he completed phase one training on the Globe in Portage La Prairie. In 02/2019, he graduated from RMC and was posted to four two nine transport squadron for OJT while awaiting phase two. While his weight was supposed to be relatively short, it quickly ballooned to over two years due to COVID and so in the intervening time period, he had the opportunity to work in CFS Alert for over four months and complete a graduate certificate in human factors.

Bryan: 02:37

He was posted to two CFFTS in Moose Jaw in July 2021, but due to some residual delays from the pandemic, Eli did not finish phase two until April 2023 before being selected to proceed onto phase three Harvard training. Eli graduated with his wings in December 2023 following a very intense month of training in the inaugural Jaw South detachment in San Angelo, Texas. Following phase two, Eli was initially streamed to be a first assignment instructor pilot on the Harvard, but thanks to a fortunate combination of timing, luck, and hard work was provided the opportunity to attend lead in fighter training in Decimomano, Italy on the t three forty six. After ten demanding yet very enjoyable months in sunny Sardinia, he graduated in April 2025 and is awaiting follow on training on the CF 18 Hornet. Now just a note for listeners, we're calling this part three of our three part series on the LIFT program.

Bryan: 03:29

You can listen to parts one and two to hear major Brian Humza Kilroy, a CF eighteen fighter pilot and instructor in Italy, talk about his experiences both in his career and all about the lift program. For this episode, we'll be getting these students' perspective. So let's talk about your early days. We touched on this in your bio, but what sparked your interest in aviation as a career?

Eli: 03:52

Yeah, Brian. Like you mentioned, I did some travel when I was younger, mostly just around BC. But every time we would go flying, I just thought getting to hop on a seven thirty seven was the coolest thing ever. Right? And so being a pilot, doing that full time seemed pretty neat.

Eli: 04:10

Not to mention getting to travel as part of your job. It seemed really interesting and just a great opportunity. And then as well, when I was 15, a local Pilots Association in Kelowna put on an event for kids where they took us up for discovery flights. So, I got to go for a ride in the Cessna. I was the oldest guy there by probably nine years.

Eli: 04:31

It was me and seven year olds flying around. But it was really cool. It kind of showed me what it takes to get an airplane airborne. And so, it really I think, excited me a little bit more than just sitting in the back, seeing it from the passenger side.

Bryan: 04:49

Yeah. It kind of takes it from like a magical experience, like, that you're kind of disconnected from. Like, the plane plane goes up and you're off on your journey to actually seeing the skills that make it all happen.

Eli: 05:02

Yeah. Absolutely. You know, seeing him go through his checklist, you know, getting to fly a little bit, you know, point plane left, point plane right. It was really cool. Yeah, really interesting.

Bryan: 05:15

So you traveled to Europe and it left you feeling inspired to serve your country. Can you tell us about that and why you didn't join the military right away at that point?

Eli: 05:23

Yeah. Touring the battlefields is a really emotional experience. You're standing on the hollowed grounds, where so many young young men fought, and died, you know, standing, for what Canada represents as a nation. Really brought in perspective how lucky I am and we all are for the rights we have as Canadians. I specifically remember standing on the grave of this 14 year old kid who died in France.

Eli: 05:48

And it made me question, as a 16 year old, who am I? Why shouldn't I do my part to serve Canada? And I of knew I wanted to be a pilot, and this interested me in military aviation. I was considering the civilian side, but we couldn't afford it. It's an expensive endeavor to do on your own.

Eli: 06:11

But I knew the military would pay for it if could get in. The thing was, when it came time to apply, I was 17, and the contract you had to sign was thirteen years. It was too much for me to sign that contract at the time. So I kind of figured, you know what? I'm going to go to a civilian university.

Eli: 06:32

I'll go get a degree in engineering. And if I change my mind, I still have a job. Let my brain mature a little bit, and see if this is something that I'm really ready, to commit to. Because it's it's a big, it's a big decision for sure.

Bryan: 06:47

It is. And I think that shows some maturity that you actually kind of realized that at age 17. I will say I was 20 when I signed up. And I think for me, I had a twelve year contract. And I was like, I was quite intimidated at 20 to to do that.

Bryan: 07:05

It is an intimidating thing when you sign on the dotted line for over a decade of service for a shot at a career that you're not sure if you're even gonna make it through the training. So I could definitely see where you were coming from at that point. So initially, you pursued civilian education, but you felt unfulfilled by this path and decided to join the CAF and attend RMC. Can you tell us what ended up bringing you back to that military path?

Eli: 07:33

Yeah. Funny. Turns out engineering is really, really hard. And I didn't really have the self discipline to fully engage with those studies. So I wasn't very successful.

Eli: 07:44

It was a pretty big shock coming from high school. I had fairly good grades back then, but it required a whole new level of work that I just was not ready for. And so that was pretty demotivating, especially since I still felt that tug, that call to service. I didn't feel like what I was doing was really getting me any closer to my what was becoming more clearly my goals. Ultimately, I knew a couple of folks who had gone to RMC or either there or graduated.

Eli: 08:11

And so I chatted with them a bit, and their experiences really excited me. It seemed like it was much more aligned with my personal motivations. Not to mention I figured a little bit of external motivation and discipline would probably help me in succeeding in post secondary education. So I dropped out of school, took a year off, and devoted myself to the application process and really just tried my best to to have a shot at pursuing this as a career.

Bryan: 08:41

Yeah. First question on that, were you worried at all that dropping out of university would hurt your chances at getting in?

Eli: 08:49

Absolutely. Yeah. That was a a big because I always hear how competitive the the pilot trade is. And I was acutely aware that it might not work, and I might not I might not get accepted. So I was pursuing some other avenues on the side.

Eli: 09:06

But at the time, they let you write a essay about why you think you'd be a good fit. And so I poured my heart into that thing. I had 10 different people edit it. And I had a fairly good record aside from my time at Civilian University. So I think the combination of those things kinda worked in my favor.

Bryan: 09:27

The other thing that you said that I like is you talked about external motivators. Basically, it sounded like you're kind of saying the discipline of the military would help keep you on the rails. I think the military is full of people who really thrive in that environment where a little bit of structure is really good for us. I know I was one of those people.

Eli: 09:47

Absolutely. Yeah. When I showed up for, you know, BMO Q, basic, it was quite the culture shock as I'm sure it is for everyone. But every day, I was like, this is this is where I'm supposed to be. This is the type of environment I think, I should be in.

Eli: 10:04

And so I think it was it was a good decision to join for me personally.

Bryan: 10:07

That's awesome. What studies did you decide to pursue at RMC and why?

Eli: 10:14

Yeah. So after figuring out the hard way that engineering wasn't for me, I decided to study physics and space science. It's a unique program, one of its kind in Canada, essentially focused on teaching the fundamentals of space applications in low Earth orbit. So you take courses in things like orbital mechanics, satellite design, space weather, remote sensing, which is essentially using satellites to look at the earth, and get data about things like crop yield, ice melt, that kind of thing. I've always found space super fascinating.

Eli: 10:49

I think it's one of humanity's greatest endeavors, both from a perspective of the value of exploration for exploration's sake, any incredible scientific and economic value it provides, to us back on Earth that I'm not sure everyone's fully aware of.

Bryan: 11:04

Yeah. Space, it's fascinating what a large topic it is and how much it affects our everyday lives. By the time this interview airs, we'll have recently aired a three part series with Erin Edwards who is a Capcom. She's a Canadian Forces pilot, but she's a Capcom down in Houston with NASA. And talking to her for a few hours was, like, eye opening.

Bryan: 11:29

Like, it's it's an amazing it's amazing work they do down there and it's crazy how much it affects everyday life.

Eli: 11:36

That is that is so cool. I've heard a little bit about her and her job seems incredible. I'm really excited to listen to that podcast.

Bryan: 11:43

Yeah. She, she's an amazing person. She is so interesting to talk to and to listen to and very, very passionate about, what she does. But, back to you. RMC can be pretty polarizing.

Bryan: 11:55

What was your experience like there?

Eli: 11:58

Yeah. RMC, it's certainly a place that can cause some pretty extreme emotions, I'll say. Yeah. It was probably the hardest thing I'd done in my life up until that point. It challenged me a lot as a person.

Eli: 12:11

As you can imagine, you know, if you're fully engaged in school, you've got a midterm first thing in the morning. Calculus, it's pretty hard. But surprise, you've got a big inspection the next morning for no particular reason. So it's 11:00 at night and you're polishing your belt buckle and ironing your socks and stuff. So there hard days.

Eli: 12:36

That being said, was really rewarding. I had some really incredible opportunities while I was there. I got to climb mountains with the exhibition club. I got to go to Ireland at OJT, which I think we're going to discuss a bit later. I got a pretty unique degree that I'm really passionate about.

Eli: 12:50

I made lifelong friends. So I have absolutely no regrets for going there. I will say RMC as an institution is evolving a lot right now. So my experiences are not going to be similar to the ones that people are having now. That being said, I don't if people ask me if they should if they should go, I don't recommend it to everyone.

Eli: 13:13

It's for certain people. And so I try and have a good discussion with them about why they wanna go.

Bryan: 13:19

Mhmm. What kind of people do you think? You say it's for certain people. Like, what kind of people do you think?

Eli: 13:24

That's a tough question. I think for people that just wanna go and have a university experience, it's certainly not for them. It's for people that want, like me, a little bit of military discipline to kinda help them through and people that are really interested in in service, would say. Because a lot of the times, the things you're doing, there isn't a whole lot of rhyme or reason outside of I'm doing this to serve, you know?

Bryan: 13:53

Yeah. So you hinted at this already. After second year, you had a really unique opportunity and went to Ireland for the summer for OJT. You went to the International Space University's space studies program. Can you tell us about that experience?

Eli: 14:09

Yeah. So the International Space University, it's an institution based in France. It puts on a number of programs. The one I attended is called the space studies program. They put it on every year.

Eli: 14:22

It's nine weeks long, and it's in a different location around the world, every year. It focuses on the interdiscipline interdisciplinary nature of space and covers topics, space engineering, space law and business, human performance in space, you know, astronaut stuff. I'm not sure if it's the exchange still exists, but when I was a student, they would send two cadets out there every summer to work as IT techs. So you're basically, you know, running cables, setting up PowerPoints, managing emails, that kind of stuff. It's pretty good.

Eli: 15:00

It was a pretty good value proposition for both institutions because the military, you know, they paid our salary, flew us out there, and we got a really great experience that led us to perform better in school. And ISU got two really motivated workers and all they had to provide was food and board. It was, just an incredible opportunity. I got to meet so many cool people, dozen astronauts, including the legendary, Canadian doctor Bob Thursk. I got to sit in on lectures from leaders from NASA and ESA because the whole the whole thing is that if you're not busy, if you're not actively doing work, you can go sit on any lecture, participate in any activity, in this program that is usually quite selective to attend.

Bryan: 15:51

Wow. What an opportunity.

Eli: 15:53

Yeah. It was it was awesome. It's also kind of a a funny first example of me being in the wrong place at the right time because that year, there was three OJT spots for students in the space science program. One was working with the USF doing satellite kind of design and management at the Air Force Academy. And they wanted the person with the best grades, the smartest guy because it seemed like it was gonna be pretty intense.

Eli: 16:20

And then, the two other guys got to go to Ireland. I fortunately wasn't, wasn't the smartest, you know, cookie in the pile. I don't know if that's a saying. But, so I got the, the worst deal and got to go to Ireland, which I'm still pretty happy about. As far as I'm aware, the air force or the military still sends one person engaged in three Canadian space division out to do the program every year because the the military sees so much value in it.

Bryan: 16:48

Yeah. Space is such a domain of growing importance, and you can see our military taking it more and more seriously every year. Let's talk a bit about your early flight training. You attended phase one flight training on The Grove after a third year in 02/2018. How did you feel as you arrived for your first flight training course in the RCAF?

Eli: 17:09

Yeah. So much, anticipation. After aircrew selection, it's really your first shot at seeing if you can actually do the job. Right? And that weighed on me a lot, flying out there for sure.

Bryan: 17:21

Yeah. Did you find that you had a lot of like self induced pressure, as a result of that or

Eli: 17:27

Yeah, absolutely. You know, it was at that point I'd dedicated three years of my life to having this opportunity and to I'd always heard how hard it was and the risk of failure is is real. And so, you know, it was kind of like, do I get to keep doing this job or do I have to pivot and do something else?

Bryan: 17:43

Yeah. Yeah, that's tough. Like that's one thing that is really challenging about your early flight training in the forces is that background knowledge and awareness that this is my career and if I don't, you know, if I fail two flights in a row, that could be it. Right?

Eli: 17:59

Yeah. Absolutely.

Bryan: 18:01

So you're always kinda it's sort of this weird dichotomy that you you need to stay aware of that and take it seriously, but at the same time, like you can't fixate on it.

Eli: 18:11

Yeah. Absolutely. I I do appreciate though that, you know, your success is almost entirely in your hands. Mhmm. So while it's a lot of pressure and stress, you have a lot of agency, which is nice.

Bryan: 18:23

Yeah. I I agree with that for sure. What was your first impression of flight training in the RCAF?

Eli: 18:30

Very demanding. It's very fast paced, but it's also delivered by, you know, true professionals who really care about your success. I didn't know anything about flying. Like, I had to stop a lecture midway through because they were talking about the the traffic pattern, and I didn't know what a downwind leg was. And so you're starting from from first principles.

Eli: 18:54

But they really structure it to get you from knowing absolutely nothing to soloing in a few weeks, which I thought was really impressive.

Bryan: 19:03

It is pretty amazing to think that because like a lot of the time I I hear from guests like, oh, yeah. I was in air cadets or I my parents set me up with a few lessons or whatever. But the the program is designed for and does regularly take people who have absolutely no flying experience and turn them into pilots within a matter of weeks. Like, that's pretty amazing. If you talk to I think if, like, the average person walked in off the street and talked to a student, a phase one student who was, like, a month in, they'd be pretty impressed with the amount of knowledge they've soaked up in that month.

Eli: 19:38

Yeah. Absolutely. I certainly leaned on my, air cadet and private pilot license colleagues during the course, just getting that, you know, corporate knowledge that wasn't directly taught. But I think that's present throughout flight training. You know?

Bryan: 19:54

100%. Yeah. That's a community flight training is a community based style of learning or it should be when you're doing it in its best form. Different people pick up on different things. Different people learn different things and make different mistakes when they're flying.

Bryan: 20:11

And you just learn from that. Right?

Eli: 20:13

Yeah. We don't we don't have all the time to make all the mistakes and learn all the lessons on our own.

Bryan: 20:19

That's right. How did phase one go for you overall?

Eli: 20:24

You know, good enough, I'll say. It was a real challenge. I was working harder than I thought was possible at the time. It's just such a massive change and a real culture shock to go from the post secondary school type learning, all theory to flight training where it's theory, theory, and then you got to go do it. Right?

Bryan: 20:43

It is a big change. It's for a lot of people, it's the first, like, very practical professional course they put their hands on. So it is a huge change from all the theory of school. And then finally, you know, there's still a theory to learn, but you're gonna put your hands on and actually do it.

Eli: 21:01

Yeah. When I first showed up, they kinda described it as it's like being there in midterms in university, but then also being in, like, hockey playoffs at the same time because you just have to there's so much pressure, and you have to physically perform at all times. Yeah. Because it just like you said on phase one, you know, you're two bad flights away from doing something else.

Bryan: 21:22

So you graduated from RMC with honors, and you were posted to four two nine Transport Squadron in Trenton, Ontario. Initially, you were expecting a short wait, but the world had other plans. Can you tell us about that?

Eli: 21:33

Yeah. So when I graduated, it was supposed to be six to nine months of waiting, which is pretty standard at the time. But as we all know, COVID happened. And so that ballooned and ended up being, two years on OJT there. It was actually a pretty cool opportunity, super big bummer at the time.

Eli: 21:52

But just being able to work at four two nine, which has such a cool mission, really opened my eyes to just the complexities of flying a multi engine aircraft around the world. And while I was always very driven to fly jets, it certainly made me a little bit more open to the idea of flying something else. Everyone in the Air Force, every pilot that I've spoken to thinks their job's the best. And a lot of the a lot of the folks in Trenton really convinced me of that.

Bryan: 22:22

Yeah. I think that that is a really important truth that man, we've said this so many times, but there is no bad cockpit in the air force to end up in. Like, they're all the like you said, everybody thinks they have the best job and how can that be how can that be unless they're all great jobs?

Eli: 22:41

Absolutely. Talking to my friends that are out flying operationally now, it's like they all they all, you know, they razz me, I razz them. Yeah. Of course. Because, you know, we all have the best job.

Bryan: 22:52

Yep. Yep. So this delay actually led to another amazing opportunity for you working at CFS Alert, the northernmost continuously inhabited place in the world. What were your experiences up there like?

Eli: 23:06

CFS Alert is an incredible, incredible place. When I was waiting for phase two, an email came out asking for someone to volunteer and work up work up there. I didn't really know a whole lot about it at the time, but, one of the things about that seemed cool to me about joining the military was that you could get to go do these neat things that no one else could. So I applied, was fortunately selected, and it was a really great, great experience. I was a projects officer up there, which basically meant I worked on procurement.

Eli: 23:40

You're also one of only roughly three commissioned officers up there. So you get some other, assorted officer type tasks that, my eight month old second lieutenant Stripe was certainly not prepared for. But, it definitely showed me that you can fill the shoes that are issued to you. You know what I mean?

Bryan: 24:00

Yeah.

Eli: 24:03

But I showed up in February. It was completely dark, and I got to watch the sunrise for the first time in months. And Alert holds a party every time the sun rises and every time the sun sets for an extended period of time, which was pretty cool. I got to see polar bears. Got to see Arctic wolves.

Eli: 24:24

Yeah. It's just a lot of things that you never get to experience living in the the relative South of Canada. But, you know, I went up there in February 2020. So in March, COVID really happened. World grinded to a halt, which for us was actually pretty benign at the start because they essentially just halted all, flights to alert, which is how we get new people.

Eli: 24:52

So we're able to keep the gym open. We didn't have to self, social distance. We had to got to keep the bar open, which was, I'm pretty sure, unique to unique in Canada. And that was that was pretty nice. But the side effect of that was that we couldn't get new people up.

Eli: 25:11

So while the military is able to order people to stay past their end of tour date, the civilian contractors up there, were not required. And the civilian contractors are responsible for essentially all the infrastructure up there. They're absolutely essential to the operation of the station. So most of them stayed, and they're fantastic, fantastic people, but some had to go home. So it ended up that all the military folks just kinda ended up wearing four, five, six, seven hats, which was interesting kinda seeing the team come together in this this adverse adverse situation.

Eli: 25:50

So COVID was really terrible in a lot of ways and as everyone knows. And I didn't really wanna wait two years for training, but I ended up getting to spend four and a half months in alert, and it's something I wouldn't trade for the world.

Bryan: 26:04

How long were you supposed to be up there?

Eli: 26:06

Only three months.

Bryan: 26:07

Okay. So you got an extra month and a half?

Eli: 26:09

Yeah. Yeah. Exactly.

Bryan: 26:11

Yeah. That must have been starting to get, pretty tiring by the end of your time there with, all the jobs everyone was doing.

Eli: 26:19

Yeah. You were working really, really long days. And it's hard up there because there's limited external communications. So you have limited, phone time. You get like one thirty minute phone call a day.

Eli: 26:33

So maintaining relationships with, you know, family back home was challenging for sure.

Bryan: 26:38

Yeah. That sounds I mean, that's like that's actually more isolated than it was for me when I went to The Middle East. Like, I had unlimited phone calls and and video chat. And that was provided, like, there was a bunch of laptops and phones and stuff you could use to call home. And then eventually we had WiFi and you could literally just FaceTime.

Eli: 26:58

Wow. That's awesome.

Bryan: 26:59

Yeah. Yeah. We've come a long way. It's it's crazy to think that it's it was easier in in The Middle East than it was in in in Alert.

Eli: 27:09

Yeah. Well, Alert is extremely isolated. The nearest settlement is, like, 850 kilometers away.

Bryan: 27:16

Wow.

Eli: 27:16

And it's, like, two hundred two hundred Inuit folks, I think. Yeah. You're closer to Moscow than you are to Ottawa when you're up there.

Bryan: 27:24

Wow. That's wild. Back to flight training. Finally, it was time for you to attend phase two flight training. How did you find flying the Harvard two?

Eli: 27:34

The Harvard is a it's an awesome, awesome plane to fly. It's really challenging, if you wanna do it well. But early on, it's it's pretty forgiving and lets you learn the basics

Bryan: 27:44

Mhmm.

Eli: 27:45

Of how to be a pilot. But it's neat because as you as you advance and start doing more more difficult phases, it really will challenge you to fly it well.

Bryan: 27:57

Yeah. I agree with that. The Harvard is a super fun plane to fly. It's very high performance. In terms of, like, the learning curve, I feel like initially, like you said, you can improve pretty quickly and get a good grasp on how to fly it.

Bryan: 28:13

But the finer points of really finessing it are challenging for sure. Like when you get into form or low level navigation or any of those things where you need a lot more finesse and and fine control, it it's challenging for sure.

Eli: 28:27

Yeah. Even the instructor pilots that fly it full time have to go up every month and, get, what they call mutual time just so they can go and and get some time on the stick and and make sure their proficiency is high because it it fades so quickly in that plane.

Bryan: 28:43

Yeah. Exactly. Did you have any particular challenges while making your way through phase two?

Eli: 28:50

Yeah. I, I failed my ICHT, the initial clear hood test, I think is what it stands for. It was my second test, and I was really beginning to realize going into that that I had pretty significant test anxiety. It was really affecting my performance. And this only compounded when it came to to reflying the test Because as we've discussed already, if you failed two tests in a row, you've technically met course failure criteria.

Eli: 29:23

And so that can mean going on and doing something else. So it was a very, very challenging period in my life. Mhmm. But passing that retest was up there on all time feelings of relief.

Bryan: 29:35

Yeah. No doubt. Anxiety and performance anxiety, test anxiety is such a difficult thing when it comes to flying because once it's once it's in there, like, really have to you can't just ignore it. Eventually, you have to find some way of conquering it. And it's such a very challenging thing because once it's there, it's there.

Bryan: 29:57

Like, if it happens to you on a on a flight, you're probably gonna experience that again. So you have to figure it out. So how did you overcome that?

Eli: 30:08

Yeah. The experience really forced me to focus on developing, the mental aspect of my my flying game, if you will. Luckily, the air force has realized that this performance and test anxiety is a very common experience in flight training and being a pilot in general. Right? Yeah.

Eli: 30:26

So they've hired mental performance coaches in Moose Jaw and in Portage La Prairie. And so I began engaging with them a lot more regularly. I also started reading books on mental performance, listening to podcasts, etcetera, because it made me realize that, you know, mental fortitude and the ability to handle these stressful situations is pretty similar to physical fitness. And it needs to be regularly trained and exercise. Right?

Eli: 30:53

So I developed my own methods, helped me focus, be in the moment, and believe that I could overcome these these challenges. I came up with a simple mantra. I always I still always say when I step to a jet, it's calm, confident, ready. And the thing is you can't just say those things. You know?

Eli: 31:14

You have to have studied to be ready. And if I had, if I felt ready, then I go into the next step. I be, am I confident? Have I chair flown this enough to feel confident? And if I am ready and I'm confident, then I can be calm and believe that all my preparation has set me up for success on this.

Eli: 31:37

And I think if you can sit down in a plane and strap it on and feel some calm, you're just you're gonna perform so much better because that experience taking an airplane airborne in the military anyways, it takes all of your focus.

Bryan: 31:53

Mhmm. Yeah, man. I have experienced both types of flying in the military for sure. I have had days where I was anxious or nervous. And those are the days where you overthink everything and you see a light come on for a second.

Bryan: 32:15

You're like, does that always happen? Like, you know, you start to overthink everything. I had a I had a instrument check one time in the King Air and I was almost at the runway and I realized I hadn't put on my shoulder straps. You know, like those are those days. And then you have days where you are calm, confident, ready and everything is just smooth as smooth as butter, you know.

Bryan: 32:39

You could you couldn't make a mistake if you tried. You're thinking 10 steps ahead And those are the days that you want to strive to obviously have have more of.

Eli: 32:51

Yeah. Those are the days that make that make being a pilot a real joy.

Bryan: 32:56

Absolutely. When you when everything is just coming together and you are just crushing it, it's such a amazing feeling.

Eli: 33:03

Absolutely.

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Bryan: 33:55

So you also learned a lot about physical preparedness on this course, which may sound counterintuitive to some because the Harvard two is not too physically demanding to fly. Can you tell us about this?

Eli: 34:05

Yeah. So early on in phase two, we were made to participate in a physical fitness program. It was designed and focused on pilots, included some core strength, compound body movements, and neck strengthening. It was Air Force sponsored and included a study associated with it. And initially, seemed pretty excessive because the hardware can pull, I think, six and a half, seven g's, but it bleeds energy fairly quickly.

Eli: 34:33

So, you know, the flights can be pretty draining, but it wasn't, physically exhausting. And I didn't see why we had to do this whole physical, you know, training regimen, to go fly it. But then step to, the Italian jet, the t three four six, which can pull eight g's with ease. It can sustain four to five all day long. And Wow.

Eli: 35:01

By the way, while you're doing that, you also are gonna be expected to be looking behind you because somebody is on your tail trying to get you. So those flights, were where I wish I'd taken the program a little bit more seriously because the jet certainly had more fight in it. It had more bite, but I had to let off the gas, because, you know, g lock, g induced loss of consciousness is a real risk. And that really drove home the importance of just being physically ready to do this job.

Bryan: 35:33

Yeah. You know, it's funny to I always admire fast jet guys for the physical side of the job that they're doing. And because I remember I I had a I grayed out one time on the Harvard because I just wasn't ready for a bit of g that came on. It doesn't take much if you're not if you're not straining. It doesn't take much for the blood to drain out of your of your brain.

Bryan: 35:57

And and that kind of g straining all the time and pulling, like you said, you know, eight g z four, five g sustain. That must be exhausting.

Eli: 36:07

Yeah. Fortunately, it's kind of like a like everything in the air force, it's a step by step process. So I know you fly the Grove, it pulls three g's. Then you fly the Harvard, it pulls six. And then they send you away for, the g course where you learn how to properly g strain.

Eli: 36:23

You're exposed to higher g loads. And then we had to do another one to go to Italy, where you had to get exposed to eight g's. And so it's a step by step process and you just kinda adapt to it. Right?

Bryan: 36:34

Yeah. That's crazy. If when you get exposed to eight g's, is that those kind of those videos that you see online of the people you're in, like, that spinning machine basically and they just whip you around until you're at eight g and you're straining kind of thing? Or how does that work?

Eli: 36:48

Yeah. It's pretty uncomfortable. They they spin you at eight g's for fifteen seconds. Wow. And you have to, last or else you don't pass.

Bryan: 36:57

Do you have, like, g pants on or anything? Or is that all with your own?

Eli: 37:02

Yeah. You wear g pants. Yeah. You wear g pants.

Bryan: 37:05

I'm I'm obviously kind of ignorant about what's possible with and without that stuff. But

Eli: 37:11

I mean, I'm sure there's, fellas a little bit, more g tolerant than I who could maybe hack it, but I need the g pants.

Bryan: 37:18

Yeah. Yeah. That's fair. So you obviously made it through phase two, and in the end, you were selected jets. How did it feel to make it that one step closer to your goals?

Eli: 37:30

Yeah, Brian. As I'm sure you can, relate, selection is is such a big event. Right? It's got so much aura around it, and I'm pretty sure every pilot can tell you something about their selection day. So to finally get there, it was a huge relief because while I always wanted to fly jets, I had matured enough, in my training to realize that I'd be super happy to fly pretty much anything in the Air Force.

Eli: 37:53

And I was excited just to have a path forward. Yeah. What am I gonna do with my career? You know? But that being said, being told I was gonna get to continue to fly the Harvard was awesome.

Eli: 38:05

The funny thing is that me and my friends always talk about this, is that, when you get selected to do phase three Harvard, which both, FAPES for assignment instructor pilots and jet pilots will do, it's just an immediate joy. But pretty quickly afterwards, you realize like, woah. Dang. I actually have to go do phase three because Yeah. It only ever gets harder with every course you complete.

Eli: 38:29

And that was true with getting selected to go to Italy. I was like so stoked. And then it's like, okay. Now I need to go learn how to fly a jet. I need to learn how to go employ it tactically.

Eli: 38:40

And same with going on to fly the Hornet. It's awesome, but I know it's gonna be harder than anything I've ever done.

Bryan: 38:46

For sure. Yeah. That's kind of the whole story of military flight training. Right? Like and and I imagine that's true to quite an extent in the civilian world as well.

Bryan: 38:54

Like, you're always moving on to bigger and better things, and that's super exciting. But at the same time, the reality, you know, comes home and and it's time to to hit the books and and really get to work.

Eli: 39:05

Yeah. Absolutely. There's no resting on your laurels in our

Bryan: 39:08

business. No. So I don't know a lot about phase three Harvard training. Can you briefly outline the course for us?

Eli: 39:17

Yeah. Absolutely. It's very similar to phase two, but they just step up all the phases a little bit and put a lot of focus on airmanship and decision making. The intent is to create an instrument rated aircraft captain in a single pilot environment. If you imagine phase two is like learning to drive your mom's car.

Eli: 39:37

You know, the basics, how to parallel park, drive on the highway. Phase three is kind of like ripping the doors off, taking to the track and seeing if you can squeeze every ounce of juice out of it. So what that looks like is, for example, in Clear Hood, you do basic aerobatics, some straightforward pattern work. On phase three, you'll max perform the aircraft and do more complex pattern work that's much more focused on energy management. For instrument flying, on phase two, you stay local.

Eli: 40:06

You go to current Regina. On phase three, you'll take it to Harvard, to San Francisco, Vancouver. Formation flying, you go from learning basics of, flying, on the wing of another guy to flying, tactically, and how to maneuver the aircraft dynamically in relation to another aircraft. And then that ties into navigation, which instead of you doing it 500 feet alone, you'll do with a partner. So you'll be a mile apart at 500 feet, navigate low level together.

Eli: 40:38

And then that all comes together, in what they call a composite phase where you'll combine multiple different types of missions into one, and you're responsible for executing any top maneuver procedure safely and legally. So you can take off, go do a bit of a low level navigation route, then you have to negotiate your way into the airspace, do some clear head handling exercises, then you go meet up with your friend, go fly some formation, and then you might come back for an instrument approach. And the whole thing is you have to, yeah, do that without breaking any rules and also get back on time.

Bryan: 41:14

That sounds really challenging.

Eli: 41:18

It is certainly a big challenge, but, you know, the instruction we get is is excellent, and they certainly get you there. And the missions are structured to to ensure your success as well.

Bryan: 41:30

Yeah. Did you find that phase three was fairly challenging or did it feel more like a continuation of phase two?

Eli: 41:37

It was definitely harder. The expectations are much higher. And I was working longer and more focused hours than I ever did on phase two. Yeah. But that being said, as we discussed, I was really prioritizing my mental performance and I had some really awesome flying continuity.

Eli: 41:53

So I enjoyed phase three a lot more than phase two.

Bryan: 41:55

Yeah.

Eli: 41:56

I was doing really hard things, but I felt ready to do them. And so it was really fun.

Bryan: 42:00

Yeah. You kind of turn that corner mentally.

Eli: 42:02

Mhmm.

Bryan: 42:03

I know when you get to phase three in the multi world, it feels like they treat you more like an adult. Did you find that was true in phase three Harvard as well?

Eli: 42:12

Certainly. Yeah. It's you're almost completely responsible for mission preparation planning, and you make almost all the decisions airborne. When I first got, started on phase three, my instructor sat me down. He wrote on the whiteboard.

Eli: 42:25

He said, phase two is a plus b equals c. And underneath, he wrote phase three is a plus question mark equals make it happen. And so the expectation is just that you're going to behave like an aircraft captain and execute a mission. Mhmm. So during the trips, they will you know, they'll teach you, specific maneuvers.

Eli: 42:45

They'll instruct you on on that kind of stuff. But they'll let you make a ton of terrible decisions and paint yourself into a corner. Mhmm. And they're not gonna say anything unless you're gonna do something, unsafe or you're gonna break a rule. And then you go learn in the debrief.

Eli: 42:58

Right?

Bryan: 42:58

Yeah. Those are the best mentors, the ones who know exactly how much rope to give you where you can make your mistakes and, like you said, paint yourself into a corner, but nothing it doesn't get to a point where it's unsafe.

Eli: 43:09

Yeah. Absolutely.

Bryan: 43:12

You got to earn your wings down in San Angelo, Texas for the first Jaw South detachment. Moose Jaw students are so used to flying in the exact same place all the time. What was it like to fly somewhere else?

Eli: 43:23

Very overwhelming at first. The airport is a commercial airport. Also, it's a civilian flying school. So there's a ton of traffic and they're not using the standard radio calls you're used to in Moose Jaw. You don't have all the same references.

Eli: 43:39

So developing situational awareness of what's going on was really challenging. But the reality of the job is that you're going to have to fly places new. You have to adapt to complex environments. So it was really cool to have the chance to, you know, grow my bucket a little bit in a relatively controlled environment.

Bryan: 43:59

Yeah. It's nice that you got to do that pre wings as well kind of before you're expected to be the adult in the room. Like, you had one last chance to go and like get this grow have this growth experience. I know I remember when I was in Moose Jaw. Now this was phase two obviously, so you're not you guys obviously on the phase three course, like you've said, you're treated more like adults and you make a lot more decisions and stuff and you've got more experience.

Bryan: 44:22

But I remember on phase two, people would freak out if the runway changed and it was like, oh, I've only flown on that runway twice. And then now you find yourself off in Texas, in a totally different environment. So like, it's it must have been quite something.

Eli: 44:38

Absolutely. I mean, I remember being like that on phase two where you're

Bryan: 44:41

For sure.

Eli: 44:42

You study so hard for these exact parameters and then they change on you, but being able to adapt so important. Right?

Bryan: 44:48

Oh, yeah. That's the the bread and butter of being a pilot. So you were initially streamed to go FABES or first assignment instructor pilot on the Harvard, but it sounds like there is a pretty good story behind you ending up attending lead in fighter training or lift in Italy. Can you tell us about that?

Eli: 45:04

Yeah. I wish it was a better story, but it's just kind of a combination of a bit of hard work. Good luck in being in the right place at the right time. My grades coming out of phase two were not the best. So while I made the cut to continue on the Harvard leadership, figured I could use some time as a a FAPE, to develop a bit more before making a decision to go on, to fly the CF 18.

Eli: 45:28

I've only heard good things about being a FAPE, but all my friends that have done it have really enjoyed their time. So actually let me relax a lot on phase three because I didn't feel like I had to fight my way through another selection. But fortunately, you know, like we discussed with the mental performance and kind of that relaxed state, It allowed me to perform quite a bit better on phase three than I did on phase two, which opened the door for that would allow me to continue directly to flying fighters. That wouldn't have mattered though if the Air Force hadn't secured two spots in Italy that weren't forecast in the 2024. And I was lucky enough to just be in the right place at the right time.

Eli: 46:12

So it just kind of goes to show you that this job is a lot of it's a lot of hard work, but it's a lot of good timing and a bucket of good luck.

Bryan: 46:21

Yeah. So many of my guests have talked about times where just chance led them to a new opportunity. And sometimes it's something that, you know, in this case, which is, like, obviously exciting, like going to a different country to do fighter lead in fighter training. Sometimes it's something like, oh, crap. I never wanted to go to this place, and then it ends up being an amazing experience.

Bryan: 46:40

So you really never know. Also, know that we are right now, as as we don't have our own lead in fighter training in Canada, they're they're working very hard to find as many slots and solutions as possible. So it's great that they they scrounged up a couple extra slots that year.

Eli: 46:57

Yeah. I'm certainly, certainly very happy about it.

Bryan: 47:00

Yeah. So let's talk about Italy. Can you briefly describe the training setup in Italy for us?

Eli: 47:08

Yeah. Absolutely. So the course occurs at what's called the International Flight Training School, IFTS, in Decimomante, Sardinia. That's an island off the West Coast Of Italy. It's run by the Italian Air Force called two twelve Squadron, but supported by civilian contracted maintenance and instructors similar to how Moose Jaw operates.

Eli: 47:31

They have a mix of military and civilian instructors that'll take you through sims and all the flights as well. Basically, the course, starts with 11 flights to convert to the aircraft type, and then you'll wrap and then you'll directly transition to the tactical phase of the course. So you'll do, BFM, which is basic fighter maneuvers, one versus one. And then you move on to air combat maneuvering, which is two good guys against one bad guy, which leads into radar intercepts where you, use your radar to go find another aircraft in a small piece of sky. Then you continue using your radar, and learn how to, do beyond visual range engagements, which means, just shooting missiles without seeing, them.

Eli: 48:18

There's also an air to ground portion, so you'll do low level navigation similar to how you would in Moose Jaw with some simulated attacks on targets. You do close air support with real JTAGs, joint terminal attract attack controllers. So they'll talk you onto a target, and you have to work with them to deliver a simulated, munition onto onto the target. Wow. Yeah.

Eli: 48:39

It was a pretty, pretty neat, experience. You also get to fly a live range. So you'll go drop real inert training bombs, and they get scored, which is a pretty pretty neat experience.

Bryan: 48:54

That's probably a fun day.

Eli: 48:56

Yeah. It's, it's like probably one of the best weeks of the course for sure. Yeah. And it all kind of culminates in you having to execute these basic strike missions where you have to go in with some simulated bombs on your jet, and then you'll go fight some bad guys and try to make delivery on time, on the correct target. You also will do some flying at night.

Eli: 49:21

So you get to fly night vision goggles, do a couple of those missions with those on. So overall, pretty pretty thorough course, I would say.

Bryan: 49:29

Yeah. That sounds like how long is the course in in time?

Eli: 49:33

It's ten months long, roughly a 150 missions.

Bryan: 49:37

Oh, wow. So that's quite a bit of quite a bit of experience. That's awesome. Who gets to attend this course, and how is it decided which Canadians go there?

Eli: 49:48

So everyone who attends Lyft will be graduates of phase three in the Harvard or FAPEs who have completed their first instructional tour. That's also true for those attending NGEP on the T 38 down at Texas or or other or other Lyft option, basically, to get guys onto the Hornet. The fighter force decides who attends Lyft and NGEP. I don't really know exactly what goes into the selection process. So I don't really speculate beyond saying that good grades and a good attitude are helpful for getting stream fighters.

Eli: 50:15

That's fair. Who goes to Italy versus Texas beyond my pay grade. But in my case, it was it was timing, spots in Italy before Texas.

Bryan: 50:25

Okay. Right on. So what is the experience like to go from a fairly simple aircraft like the Harvard two to the t three four six?

Eli: 50:33

It's a lot. Yeah. Even something as simple as gaining an understanding of all the new symptom systems on a twin engine jet, and then also how to incorporate all the new information it's spitting out at you and your cross check is pretty challenging. I completely forgot about the HUD for the first couple of flights. I was just flying off this the displays down below.

Eli: 50:56

So adapting to all that's pretty challenging. You also have to be really aware of the the jet's capabilities. It accelerates really easily. It's really hard to slow down. It'll give you eight Gs.

Eli: 51:07

No problem. It also rolls on a it's like it's sitting on top of a pen. Yeah. And so a really common experience is you'll take off for your first flight. You go to turn out to the area and you just apply the standard amount of left roll that you think you would need, and you just roll about a 120 degrees

Bryan: 51:22

Oh, wow.

Eli: 51:22

Upside down because it, it rolls so quickly. But, yeah. I'd say the Harvard prepares you well, but it's certainly a big step up.

Bryan: 51:31

How difficult is the t three four six to fly overall?

Eli: 51:35

I'll be honest. It flies like a dream.

Bryan: 51:38

Yeah.

Eli: 51:38

It's, it's designed to be really easy to fly because tactical phases, you just don't have the brain bites to devote to flying it, as you as much as you would if you weren't doing a tactical mission.

Bryan: 51:51

For sure.

Eli: 51:52

So it has things that help you with that. It's fly by wire, and they have this thing called carefree handling, which basically means you can put any control input at any airspeed, any attitude, and it will not depart, and it will not overstress the aircraft.

Bryan: 52:08

Okay.

Eli: 52:09

It also has auto trim in the pitch axis, which means that if I put the nose on the horizon, it won't climb and it won't descend. So you can just kinda put it there and leave it, and it'll do its own thing. And it also has an autopilot, which is awesome. You do need to learn how to fly the autopilot as almost as much as you need to learn how to fly the jet. Mhmm.

Eli: 52:27

But overall, it's a yeah. A very straightforward aircraft to fly.

Bryan: 52:32

Yeah. And that's pretty standard, in terms of the autopilot stuff. Like automation, is obviously a huge workload reducer. But it is because they are so sophisticated, they also can be fairly complex and having like a a very, very good understanding of them is is critical.

Eli: 52:52

Yeah. Absolutely.

Bryan: 52:54

Yeah. From a student perspective, how demanding is the course in Italy?

Eli: 53:00

Yeah. It's it's pretty demanding. It's a very high pace of learning throughout. Like I said, you only get 11 flights to transition to the aircraft. So it's couple solo, like sorry, single ship flights.

Eli: 53:13

You do, like, six formation flights. And then after that, they stamp you, you know, seal of approval. You can go fly this thing safely domestically. So after that, they just start piling it on because you've proven that you can do this at a basic level. So for example, night flying, you will do one single ship night flight.

Eli: 53:36

And then the next flight, you're gonna be flying in formation off another jet. And it's possible that's your second night flight ever. You can also have it where you'll finish your your transition phase on the jet, and then you'll do two BFM flights. And then after that, you're taking it solo. And so to go so quickly from, you know, a prop to a twin engine jet, So now I'm taking this jet solo.

Eli: 54:06

I'm gonna go fight another aircraft. It's it's a really steep learning curve and really challenging. But over there, they they really leverage simulation a lot, which is really helpful because because it's so easy to fly, you don't need so much of the hands and feet, seat of the pants kind of sensations. Right. And it's a lot of systems management and that type of thing.

Bryan: 54:27

Mhmm. A little while ago, I did a series with with Dan McWilliams. He was a Cold War f eighteen pilot, one of the first cadres on the f 18. And that was something he said about learning to fly the f 18 was it's a beautiful aircraft. It's easy to fly.

Bryan: 54:42

The the real challenge is all the system management. And I think that's probably gonna be true on any modern fighter. Like more and more aircraft, especially military aircraft, are are a weapons platform or a systems platform to to accomplish some mission. So the systems management is really where most of the work goes in.

Eli: 55:05

Yeah. It's definitely where you make your money. On the later flights, it's like 90% of dealing with what's happening on the screens. And then you have to bring your head up. Okay.

Eli: 55:14

I'm still flying around, still flying an airplane. And then you go back to like the systems management.

Bryan: 55:19

Yep. Yep. That sounds familiar. So how did the course go for you?

Eli: 55:27

It went well. There's a lot of hard moments, you know, in days where I was pushed to the limits of my, you know, limited experience. But that's kind of the point. Right? Me and my wingman, we're luckily able to make it through without any major hiccups, but that's largely thanks to the awesome instruction and the support we got from over there.

Bryan: 55:46

That's great. And how did you enjoy Italy itself?

Eli: 55:50

It was awesome as you as you can imagine. The food was great. Great pasta, good pizza. Because it's an island, you're only ever about thirty minutes away from really world class beaches, which was a nice way to decompress and unwind, pretty close to Europe so you can take some trips on long weekends. Yep.

Eli: 56:10

And most of all, just the people. It's an international school. So you're getting instruction from, you know, Greek pilots, Belgian pilots, British pilots, and really making lifelong friends. Like, I have connections all over the world now, thanks to that time I got to spend over there.

Bryan: 56:26

That's pretty amazing. I used to enjoy that about Moose Jaw. I don't know how many is there still a fairly international presence or or fairly large international presence in in Moose Jaw?

Eli: 56:37

No. The last Hungarian the Hungary was the last country to still be flying as part of NFTC, and they pulled out a year or two ago.

Bryan: 56:46

Okay. Yeah. I used to really enjoy that about Moose Jaw though. The meeting of people from Italy, from Hungary. There was a few other countries there at the time as well.

Bryan: 56:57

It's a it's a cool experience getting that that multicultural flavor in your flight in your flight training and and getting to meet people from all over the world.

Eli: 57:06

Yeah. Absolutely.

Bryan: 57:10

So you're now waiting to start training on the CF 18 Hornet. Are you excited to get out there and get on an operational jet?

Eli: 57:17

Yeah. Yeah. I can't wait. As I've mentioned before, it's, you know, a bit of a double edged sword because I'm I've got a lot of excitement, but there's also a lot of anticipation because I know it's just gonna challenge me more than any flying course I've done yet.

Bryan: 57:31

Yeah. But at least at this point, you've developed a lot more of the tools to deal with that. Right?

Eli: 57:38

Yeah. I do feel like going through flight training has given me a good set of tools that I'll need to to get me through the course.

Bryan: 57:48

Yeah. And and speaking of that, do you think you've been well prepared by Lyft?

Eli: 57:52

I hope so. Talking to Hamza, who I think you're to, he's the senior instructor senior Canadian instructor over there. He was also an instructor on the CF eighteen's OTU, the training course for the Hornet, as well as the two fellows who did the course before me and are now flying the Hornet. It sounds like the syllabus they present, in Lyft, it's a pretty solid job of, providing a baseline for continuing onto the Hornet. Lots of work to do, but, I'm gonna choose to believe them.

Bryan: 58:24

Yeah. Well, I mean, the course you did sounds very challenging and it sounds very thorough. So I would imagine it's gonna be a pretty good prep for the, CF 18 course.

Eli: 58:35

Yeah. From what my understanding is that the the syllabus you do in Italy is is pretty similar to the syllabus you'll do on the fighter pilot course. So hopefully, it'll you know, I won't have done everything to the to the level that they're obviously gonna teach me to do it, but I'll have like have done an introduction, you know?

Bryan: 58:53

Yeah. Yeah. For sure. What are you most excited for in the operational jet world?

Eli: 58:59

I've been training in some form or another for the last ten years. It's been a really long road. So I'm really excited to do the real thing. I will say ten years is not the standard anymore. It's gotten a lot better Mhmm.

Eli: 59:11

Since COVID and stuff. Right? Yeah. The reality of flying fighters though is the train never stops. I'm looking forward to that, But, I think it'll be really cool to hold the queue, serve Canadians, and give back, a little bit for all the air forces, even me in the last ten years.

Bryan: 59:30

Yeah. A 100%. And and when you say hold the queue, you're talking about the quick reaction force. Right?

Eli: 59:34

Yeah. Absolutely. The the folks that are sitting around twenty four seven monitoring and defending our airspace.

Bryan: 59:40

Yeah. And you're totally right. Like, the work the work never ends. Right? No matter what you end up flying in, you're you're always training.

Bryan: 59:47

You're always working at it. But I totally get what you're saying that after all this time, there's gonna be a certain satisfaction of finally getting on your operational aircraft.

Eli: 59:56

Yeah. Absolutely. There will be a day at some point in the future where I am not getting actively evaluated during a flight, and that is exciting.

Bryan: 01:00:05

Yes. And that is a nice feeling too to just be able to fly, let me tell you. So let's close out with our, final three questions. What would you say is one thing that you consider essential to do to stay ready to do your job?

Eli: 01:00:19

I'm really big on sleep. Getting a good night's rest has always been really important to me, to excel while flying. I was doing post secondary education. Yeah. So I I kinda main try to maintain that in in my, you know, cross check, so to speak.

Eli: 01:00:36

When I was on phase two, my flight commander sat us all down for a briefing on crew rest. He spelled it out pretty clearly, and he said, well, we have a twelve hour crew duty day limit before we go home. Our duty didn't really cease then because in general, air crew are, you know, broadly entitled to twelve hours of rest between duty periods. And his point was that after our crew duty day ends, it is now our new duty to go and make sure we use that time to get appropriately rested for our missions the next day. You know?

Eli: 01:01:06

And so that really, yeah, brought it home for me. I've never really been the guy to pull an all nighter or cram, and I realized that operationally, the opportunities for rest may be a bit more irregular, but I really intend on focusing on it moving forward.

Bryan: 01:01:24

Yeah. I couldn't agree more. Sleep is essential. You've just earned your wings and have seen people succeed in fail out of flight training. What do you think makes a great jet pilot?

Eli: 01:01:36

Yeah. I don't I'd say I'm probably underqualified to define what makes a great jet pilot, But I'll highlight some attributes of the folks that I looked up to during training.

Bryan: 01:01:47

Sure.

Eli: 01:01:48

One, were all extremely hard workers. They studied harder. They prepped more. They cheerfully more thoroughly than anyone else. But to go with that, they were also extremely humble.

Eli: 01:02:00

Despite doing better than anyone else, they realized the job is really all about learning. And so when they come back from a trip, you'd ask them how it went. They're not gonna stand there and, you know, tell tales of how awesome they were. They're just gonna get straight into the stuff that they did poorly and brainstorm a little bit about how to do better and just try and pass that learning on to everyone else.

Bryan: 01:02:21

Right on.

Eli: 01:02:22

Yeah. And then just the final thing is they're all just really, really good people and team players, you know, because the fast track community can get this has this kind of stereotype. It's just a bunch of individuals flying around doing their thing. But the reality is that despite being alone in your own cockpit, every mission essentially is flown as a pair at a minimum. And you work as a team much the same way as a aircraft commander and a first officer would.

Eli: 01:02:45

Right? So having a good attitude and having someone that you trust is super important. And they just all demonstrated that day to day through their actions and words, you know.

Bryan: 01:02:58

Yeah. That's awesome. If you ran into a student pilot that really wanted to attend Lyft, what advice would you give them?

Eli: 01:03:07

Yeah. It's a very long very long road, and it's challenging. And it doesn't get any easier the further along you get. That being said, the long days of studying and the years of training it takes are super rewarding. I'm really thankful for the opportunities I've had.

Eli: 01:03:24

I don't regret any of them for a minute. And nothing beats going up solo in a jet on a Friday afternoon for a dogfight.

Bryan: 01:03:30

Yeah. I believe it. Okay, Eli. That's gonna wrap up our chat for today. Man, this has been so cool to have you go from reaching out to the show to ending up as a guest on the show.

Bryan: 01:03:42

I'm really thankful that you've given us some of your time today and put yourself out there. So thank you very much and, we'll, we'll talk to you soon.

Eli: 01:03:50

Awesome. It's been a pleasure. Thanks, Brian.

Bryan: 01:03:52

Yep. Fly safe.

Eli: 01:03:53

Thanks.

Bryan: 01:03:55

Okay. That wraps up our three part series on the lead in fighter training or lift program in Italy. For our next series, we will be sitting down with major Ian Wookie to talk about his experiences flying the CH one forty seven f Chinook. Do you have any questions or comments about anything you've heard in this show? Would you or somebody you know make a great guest, or do you have a great idea for a show?

Bryan: 01:04:17

You can reach out to us at the pilotprojectpodcast@Gmail.com or on all social media at at pod pilot project. And be sure to check out that social media for lots of great videos of our RCAF and mission aviation aircraft. As always, we'd like to thank you for tuning in and ask for your help with the big three. That's like and follow us on social media, share with your friends, and follow and rate us five stars wherever you get your podcasts. That's all for now.

Bryan: 01:04:42

Thanks for listening. Keep the blue side up. See Engineer, shut down all four. Shutting down all four engines.